The new SB project

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Xela on Wed Sep 12, 2012 4:59 pm

OverHao wrote:Well for me thursday was ok but we have 2 main problem:
1 - my english speaking skill was embarrassing XD
2 - What happened to the programmers?

Anyway, I'm continuing to work on various ideas, but exactly what we need to get started?


I am still around... but like I said, if there a professional coder is available I will gladly step down. We need graphics I guess? You have already laid out general screen designs, looks decent... Maybe some concrete things like:

- Picture categories
- Dialogue categories
- Traits
- Stats
- Effects

and so on, also a scale for stats like max, min and etc. List of Jobs, Kinds of rooms and so on. Basically a plan is needed...

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Re: The new SB project

Post by OverHao on Wed Sep 12, 2012 5:48 pm

Thank you. I think I get the idea, I immediately start working Smile
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Re: The new SB project

Post by Kingsblood on Thu Sep 13, 2012 6:46 pm

I always thought it would be a good idea to somewaht step up the complexity of characters rather than having an enormous harem of 60 or so generally similar characters. Like 6 or 7 with an extensive list of traits and perks etc. (something like Fallout 3) where perks are awarded after doing something worthwile rather than sucking off X customers by clicking end turn 60 times.

If you have room on the team still I might be able to contribute, I have worked on some MMO's previously (ancient and medieval warfare and science fiction) No experience in porn though. I like to craft technology trees and write fiction and such. Unfortunately I can't write code at all. I could show some of my work but that would be too commercial.

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Re: The new SB project

Post by kippei13 on Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:58 am

anyone feel free to add me on skype. my name on skype is kippei_13, i'm available from now (6pm EST) until 11 pm and then for an hour or two after 1 am. i don't have a mic so don't worry about actually talking we can just use the instant message part Smile

kinsbrood i will personally make sure that there aren't just stock characters. i agree with you that every girl should have a background no matter how many of them that there are.
i wouldn't exactly call this porn though Razz maybe i'm just trying to save my ego though c:

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Re: The new SB project

Post by kippei13 on Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:14 am

actually i'm going to go to bed now, Overhao i still think we need to have our meeting so please tell me a time for tomorrow (just say how many hours untill you can be on or tell me that time it is where you are when you post your message

thanks

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Kingsblood on Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:24 am

Skype would be quite difficult since i'm European. (GMT +1)

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Re: The new SB project

Post by OverHao on Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:27 pm

umh... I do not really agree with Kingsblood, from my point of view have a complex girls system can overload the game system... I prefer something more light and addictive... what you suggest is more in "Slave Maker" style that have a different focus point (i want to focus the game on the brothel and not on the girls)

however, the game will have RPG elements that will make it less flat and more enjoyable:

- storyline

- to obtain girls from the city you will deepen your relationship with them, talking to them and completing some tests on the characteristics

and more...

However thanks for the advice... I will try a way to make the girls more unique without complicating things too much ... Smile
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Re: The new SB project

Post by kippei13 on Tue Sep 18, 2012 2:20 am

what i meant was that each girl would have a back story more complex than a couple sentences and we wouldn't just throw in some girls as filler.

i think we should aim for it being simply complex. on the outside its a very simply played game. but if the player takes the time they can go in-depth and discover all the complexities about it to be able to play better overall.

even with our focus on the brothel we shouldn't neglect other parts of the game like what happened in Mirror's Edge. great game, fun to play, but meant to be played without using guns. they put guns in it, you can use them, but your not supposed to. this ended up being one of the biggest complaints of players, the gun combat sucked. with a little bit more effort they could have gotten rid of that.

i still think we need to get in contact on skype, i'm not really sure what to do right now. if we had a meeting we could quickly get me on track so that i know exactly what i'm doing and be able to work constantly for a while.

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Kingsblood on Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:14 am

Should you add any given feature it would be best to make it a really good one rather than having a fifteenth assassins creed with tower defense, collecting little flags, some crappy alchemy/shop bombing and a front library thrown in.

From what I have heard the emphasis is on buildings and real estate development with a brothel theme. You might want to take that aspect all the way instead of the somewhat redundant building system we have now.

For example:
You can have 100 girls in 10 buildings now and they are all roughly the same because they all follow the same skill set but are at different points depending on their experience (which is linked to when you hired them). When you get them rolling they all develop similarly. That's what i meant when i said to have a more complex girl system, not that you need 5000 characteristics like in those 80's text-rpg's but rather they can have some nifty traits based on acomplishing strange missions (like fallout) or having traits develop based on actions instead of experience (like total war).


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Re: The new SB project

Post by Xela on Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:14 am

Some points...

1) Deeper story is not a good idea since we'll be using Anime/Manga/Game characters. Maybe a funny/amusing and unique stories for some girls can be created as they enter the game (With a skip option).

2) Deeper mechanics will push as towards a new WM, not a new SimBro and I wouldn't say all girls in SimBro come out the same anyway.

We need to figure out how to make a game without to much repetitive micro and yet interesting and yet with some event depth... that feels more important than a complex girl system that can make any of the 100 girls really unique from her peers. We can add specialization to give each girl a purpose, anything past that feels like an overkill for SimBro.

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Kingsblood on Wed Sep 26, 2012 7:29 pm

The way I see it there were 2 ways to earn money and experience, being prostitution and special projects. Having four people at most doing special projects and the rest prostituting themselves was most efficient. I never got stripping and serving food and such off the ground. That's what I meant with everyone ending up the same. You don't have to write an entire biography for every girl obviously. Splitting specializations sounds good, rather than only having prostitutes, having moviestars, classy courtesans, showgirls whatever. Im sure the Japanese can think up more sick stuff than I can.

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Xela on Wed Sep 26, 2012 9:51 pm

Kingsblood wrote:The way I see it there were 2 ways to earn money and experience, being prostitution and special projects. Having four people at most doing special projects and the rest prostituting themselves was most efficient. I never got stripping and serving food and such off the ground. That's what I meant with everyone ending up the same. You don't have to write an entire biography for every girl obviously. Splitting specializations sounds good, rather than only having prostitutes, having moviestars, classy courtesans, showgirls whatever. Im sure the Japanese can think up more sick stuff than I can.

You are describing a different game here. We are making a SimBro, you are suggesting something along the lines of OtherWorld but with brothel instead of a house. I think along the lines of taking the original SimBro concept and adding more versatile jokers, ways to meet girls, some events and a more interactive brothel + room buildup system. I think this is the heading this should take.

The trouble with trying to expand to much of the original is that it will ages to code, write and design. The moment you say moviestar I think of a special building for that, like a studio, than I start thinking that we could use a city map and different dialog system cause a famous moviestar should behave and act differently than a prostitute or courtesan and than you have a whole different game with new goals...

SimBro is Simulation of a Brothel. OverHao wants to add more graphics to it and a decent girlmeet system. That sounds like a good and clear concept. As far as I am concerned moviestars have nothing to do with brothels and that is an overkill already... Maybe after a girl is trained we could create something along the lines of renting her out for a pornmovie or photoshoot and than get paid or even better requests from an agency for girls of certain skills and traits. In any case, for starters we need to decide on solid stuff like:

Xela wrote:

- Picture categories
- Dialogue categories
- Traits
- Stats
- Effects

and so on, also a scale for stats like max, min and etc. List of Jobs, Kinds of rooms and so on. Basically a plan is needed...

- add Gameflow to that...
- add Mechanics to that as well. How do we handle micro? Do girls go to rest on Auto or do you have to do that manually, if manually than we'll need a list like in Nothin's version and an iterator to go over that. How do we handle sickness?

I've already started to code some shit about two month ago but quickly realized that I have no idea how OverHao plans to handle stats, traits, picture categories (we can just do random draws like in SimBro1x or have solid picture categories for each act).

Writing all of that out is a pain so maybe we can just take one of the SimBro versions as a blueprint and simply decide on what we'll do differently?

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Kingsblood on Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:43 pm

True enough. On a more abstract level I have some experience with making games, basically it is really a relation of numbers with some prose thrown in to make sense of it all. Basically you could rehash a skill tree of a priest or a governor and use it to make a skill tree of a prostitue only with skills like sucking a man's dick rather than administrating armies. Also passive effects, effects over time, activated abilities, construction of rooms/buildings/special projects happen in much the same way. There probably is something we could use.

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Kingsblood on Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:46 pm

Just so we're on the same level here

with stats you mean strength, dexterity etc.

with traits you mean things like exceptional ambusher/administrator/dick sucker

with effects you mean things like sick, injured, knocked out

correct?

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Xela on Fri Sep 28, 2012 3:01 am

Kingsblood wrote:Just so we're on the same level here

with stats you mean strength, dexterity etc.

with traits you mean things like exceptional ambusher/administrator/dick sucker

with effects you mean things like sick, injured, knocked out

correct?

Same level of what? lol You meant same page, right?

Yeah, that's what I meant but you are not giving a good example since most of those stats were not in any of simbrothels Smile

- Stats are statistics that enumerate girls ability and determine how well she preforms at given task, how willing she is to do what is asked of her. Strength, Charisma, Beauty, Libido and so on.

- Traits are also descriptors but they instead of having a value they either modify/freeze/cap stats (Smart, Cute, Sexy) or simply describe the girl (Blond Hair, Huge boobs) and serve as fetishes for costumers.

- Effects are more temporary like 'sick' as you pointed out or lets say 'horny' if Libido runs to high.

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Re: The new SB project

Post by OverHao on Mon Oct 01, 2012 3:17 am

here some of the game features I'm working on...

- In the game there will be two types of girls:

1- Originals girls created specifically for the game
Spoiler:
to get them you will need to meet them in town and facing a "multi-choice game" (choosing from time to time what to say to deepen the relationship with the girl) you can make a choice a day for a total number of choices variable from girl to girl, sometimes there will be tests on the characteristics of the main character (for example, a test of strength to save the girl from a gang of thugs) the different choices and results lead to different endings: good (hire, seduce the girl) neutral (nothing happens in particular) and bad (trouble, malus)
obviously avoiding to make a system too boring and complicated
If you fail the "relationship game" but you want the girl at all costs you can pay (a lot) Etna to get her through succubus mind control

2- Famous girls of anime and manga
Spoiler:
you can get them through the cards
each card evokes a specific girl
the cards may be obtained in different ways, you can:
buy them from the card-store
find them in specific places
get them from NPC
get them from special events
and get them from quests
once summoned will be just like normal girls
This system eliminates the need to create complex and improbable stories to justify the presence of famous girls from different times and settings in the history of the game
that make the game gain a sense of coherence
and will give to the players the fun of collecting the cards


- Positions available in the brothel will be: housemaid,security,waitress,prostitute
girls can be specialized in one position and get special talent from events and school
waitress generate random earning based on the number of customers and waitress level
security reduces or cancels the possibility of the occurrence of events like riots, damage to the brothel, customers who do not pay etc...

-Every brothel will have the following characteristics:
fame: indicates how much is the brothel known (influenced by advertising and average prostitute fame) influence the number of customers
structure: indicates the material quality of the brothel ( influenced by furniture ) influence the customers satisfaction
service: indicates the quality of the sevice (influenced by waitress ) influence the customers satisfaction
theme: you can make thematic brothel and obtain a bonus on customer number and satisfaction ( influenced by girls coerence with the theme, thematic uniform, thematic furniture )
hygiene: indicates how much is the brothel clean


-working shifts: once decided the girl job you can decide how hard she have to work (this will affect the balance of the auto-rest system)
I was thinking about a bar with five levels from the level heaven until hell, every level put the girl to rest after the loss of one quarter of the stamina bar
Spoiler:
you can put to rest the girls and send them to school manually
(the hygiene of the girls will be influenced by the quality of the bath, the type of uniform, the quality of beds and the cleanliness of the brothel there will not be the hygiene option ... really... have to say to a person when bathing is ridiculous ...)



-I wish that every act has its image category (but we must consider whether this is possible for each one of the girls)


PS: for kippei I would like to have a meeting but our time zones are very different so it will be very difficult
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Re: The new SB project

Post by Nergal49 on Mon Oct 01, 2012 4:42 am

What sort of ratio should we expect between original and anime girls? while easier to provide more story to original girls, I think anime girls will be much more popular.

Will the starter girls be pre-determined or randomized. I do not mind pre-determined for story modes if that is easier as far as making a story is concerned, but could there be a mode which uses a randomized starter?

I also have questions about difficulty, will there be the same three difficulties we had in the original sim brothel, easy medium and hard? Someone earlier suggested an increase in debt to make it more difficult, but I remember the original Brothel made things more expensive. Could there be more perks to harder difficulties such as more girls to motivate people to try harder difficulties.

Another inquiry I have is about length of the game. The original Sim Brothel the game ended after 360 days. Sim Brothel 1x ended after 5 years. What sort of time limit should we expect in this version of sim brothel?

I'm not sure what or if you have decided on a storyline or not, but rather than have it based on a pre-scripted dialogue you could just allow the player at certain story events multiple choice questions.

I thought of a tentative story involving the main girl waking in a sort of limbo like place without her memories with a demon or a devil offering to return the girl back to her home, in exchange the girl must pay the demon x amount of money. The demon/devil provides the girl a starting home and an assistant to help her on her quest. Depending on how much money she obtains and how many events you the player pass determines the ending. The decision at the end of the story should be whether to continue or end the game and return home.

I liked the event jokers in sb1 and i like earning regular jokers in sb1x. I would suggest event jokers add to the story a bit. For instance in my story idea the event could be to stop the serial arsonist, which would require you upgrade a girl to have strong security stats. If she eventually catches the girl committing an arson the story would go on to reveal that the demon/devil that you work for promised the arsonist that they would be released from limbo if they succeeded in sabotaging you. The event would end exposing a bit of the story and would net you the arsonist as a girl.

Edit:

Also, will there be unlockables in this game for instance if you get a certain ending you unlock a new girl card or a new difficulty or mode? I think it would be nifty if you could add a classic mode featuring the basic story and goals of the original sim brothel, but I understand that might be more effort than its worth.
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Re: The new SB project

Post by Terashi on Fri Oct 05, 2012 1:31 pm

Nergal49 wrote:Also, will there be unlockables in this game for instance if you get a certain ending you unlock a new girl card or a new difficulty or mode? I think it would be nifty if you could add a classic mode featuring the basic story and goals of the original sim brothel, but I understand that might be more effort than its worth.

i think it is too far for our possibilities (for now) btw the idea if a possibility of unlock more alternative finals and something like archievements (and why not a girl if you do the max score) should be not discarded....

@overhao:
the idea of cards is perfect,so we don't have to make too many explanations on the girls
i like the idea of the work-level with stamina
for the immage category we can work after (probably some girls in the first concept of the game could not have the right immage)
ah what will be the ratio of manga girl/original girl?
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Re: The new SB project

Post by Xela on Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:36 pm

Ok, lets 'debug' Smile

@OverHao

1) Original girls vs Famous girls concept is not gonna work, it is as simple as that. Many people prefer girls from Anime/Games/Manga/Hentai/Toons etc. Limiting those to just jokers is a really bad idea. SimBro 1x has a very good concept of meeting girls in various places and increase disposition through talking/giving gifts/dating that we can use as well.

Basically here we can specify a 'way to meet' for every girl. Possibilities would be Slavemarket/Joker/Meet in town. Maybe more later.


2) Positions... Security and Prostitute are both great. Maybe we can try to combine Housemaid and Waitress into one: Service Girl that takes care of the building and other costumer needs (other than sex I mean). I am yet to see a simbrothel where housemaids and waitresses really mattered and were useful/important/interesting part of a game. With Service Girls we can simply make it so that the brothel falls apart and all customers are unhappy, maybe even do occasional striptease to get the customers riled up and advertise the building so you have to invest in them.

3) Brothel characteristics: Are all fine, I feel like reputation is missing.

4) Working shifts seems like a great idea, but what it means to work harder is not completely clear to me, in SimBrothel how hard a girl works always depended more on the amount of clients than on any other setting.

5) Every act can have it's image category for every girl, it's not a question of possibility but preference.

--------------------
@Nergal

1) It wouldn't be hard to simply allow everyone to mod the game picking girls that they like.

2) It's SimBrothel so there shouldn't be an advanced story mode. Maybe Etna as a 'Service Girl' and a couple of random jokers.

3) Difficulties are an overkill I think, it might not be worth it.

4) Length is a good question as well... the trouble with that is math, it is remarkably hard to make interesting missions/rewards for a game with an undetermined amount of resources (girls, brothel, jokers and so on). Maybe different debt amount to determine the difficulty is a better approach.

5) I recall we decided to go with an interesting intro with Etna being a 'bottombitch' for the game. Rest of the story will be normal SimBro line of events.

6) We can add events to the game but what you suggest seems to complex...

7) Unlockables are possible but only if we figure out a way to make it worth the effort.

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Terashi on Sat Oct 06, 2012 7:45 pm

@Xela

the number of customers in the first SimBrothel depends on the % of health on the girl
and the money earned from an algorithm of the stats (charisma,sex stats,refiniment,level of the prostitute and customers)

the idea of working shifts can be used to have a Caps to the number of customers and so have a reduction of stress to the maid
you can also consider that:if you have an high ranked girl she will take every customers to the brothel and the other girls will remain without exp and job....
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Re: The new SB project

Post by OverHao on Tue Oct 09, 2012 3:13 am

@Xela

1) my concept of card is very different from joker seen in other SIMBRO
the cards will be a central part of the game ,since the original girls will be 10 or at most 20 (is hard to imagine that all the girls in a city are willing to prostitute) however, we can always put some famous girls in the city and upon completion of their "storyline" or anything like they will give us their card

2) Service Girl was a great idea ^^

3) reputation was in my first list of characteristics but after I did not know how to define it (What can in the game define the reputation of the place?)
so I removed it ,if you know how to insert it would be perfect

4) we have two way to make them work more o less:
-the girl goes auto-rest when he consumed a certain amount of stamina and does not return to work until he has recovered the necessary stamina (skipping a few working turns)

-even better is the idea of Terashi, limiting the number of customers

5) perfect , I prefer to have an image for each act XD

@Others...

-the story will last 360 days(with records,achievements,bonus,mission and jokers) and (if possible) the game will continue in sandbox(no time limits,no record,no achievements etc..)

-for now I have no idea of how to include...records,achievements,bonus,mission and jokers XD XD

-would be nice to have some unlockable bonus (we'll work on that)

-at some points of story there will be multiple choices that will lead to different endings
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Re: The new SB project

Post by Xela on Tue Oct 09, 2012 3:48 pm

1) I am not entirely clear on your concept of jokers but it's all good as long as we don't limit Anime girls.

2) Yeap, if we all on the same page here we need to figure out specifics and I'll start coding them in.

3) My take on reputation:

It's a hidden integer between 0 - 15000 with default being 5000. Game displays to the player:

0 - 1000 =) Peace of sh1t
1000 - 2500 =) Dreadful
2500 - 4000 =) Bad
4000 - 6000 =) Normal
6000 - 8000 =) Good
8000 - 10000 =) Very good
10000 - 12500 =) Awesome
12500 - 15000 =) Spectacular

We can work on definitions later, this is from the top of my head and not very well though through.

Reputation goes down if girls refuses a costumer, provides a bad service or in case of negative events like girl beating the crap out/stealing from costumer, etc.

Reputation goes up if girl provides good service/does something extra or in case of positive events like costumer finding girl of his/her dreams (based on traits) in your brothel, etc. Only girls of very high levels can take rep above 10000 and only the highest level above 12500.

I think we can make that work...

4) There are more than two ways to make it work, we simply need to decide on something.

5) Ok, I prefer it like this as well.

----------

- 360 days feels to short but it is doable.

- Including that stuff is a matter of creativity... The trouble is that it will prolly take a long time to make it work well and be interesting to players so we can just add it later.

- Unlockable bonus can be basically mean anything... we need to work on that like you said Smile

- I am still not in favor of story so complex that it would lead to different endings as a result of multiple choices instead of stats on the last day... it may no longer feel like a SimBrothel game then Sad

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Re: The new SB project

Post by Terashi on Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:35 pm

STEALING IS NOT BAD FOR REPUTATION XD XD WE WILL THE OLD YUFFIE WHO STEAL TO THE CUSTOMERS XD XD XD

btw 360 day is enough (because have too time will lead you to take it too easy).

for unlockable bonus i'm dubious about what you can give as a bonus, i suggest to give stuff like money bonus or equips ( if they will be in the game) after 3/4 archievements unlocked and only 1 (AND I SAID ONLY ONE) girl unlocked after unlocking all archievements and playing all the difficult level.

i'm suggest to don't give a complex story,better only a foggy plot
but give different ending as a result of the score and the number of your "workers" (if i don't remember wrong also in the first simbrothel it was the same)


@overHao:
have you started to program the game? Xp XD
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Re: The new SB project

Post by Terashi on Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:45 pm

ah yes what about of a "game over" possibility?
in the first Sim Brothel if you gain gold more than your biggest house's valor X3 or you go under -100k of gold you will have only - infinite gold...locking you the possibility to buy anything more than that what you still have....


(i hope i had explain it clear XD XD)
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Re: The new SB project

Post by Xela on Thu Oct 11, 2012 3:30 pm

Stealing from costumers may be good for your wallet but never a good thing for rep...

Did OverHao say he'll do the coding? I was originally supposed to take care of that but after I've started to code I had 100x questions about what girls and brothels were supposed to be like so I quit until we could agree on some basic concept.

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